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 Post subject: 4 stud wheels
PostPosted: Fri Sep 08, 2017 10:56 am 
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Hello, I require help with the following. I am trying to find out why Toyota Team Europe used 4 stud/bolt wheels on their competition cars. My guess is that they used a Toyota component to upgrade their setup that had the 4 stud configuration. I cannot find proper information on this. Interestingly, Audi did the reverse in their competition cars, going from a four stud in standard car to 5 stud on the Ur. Thanks in advance.


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 Post subject: Re: 4 stud wheels
PostPosted: Fri Sep 08, 2017 1:01 pm 
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I suspect that they adopted some drivetrain components (drive flanges) from the similar era Corrolla which is 4x100 PCD. Why - I have no idea!

Audi used 5x112 PCD on the road going UR Quattro ( I've had a few old Audi coupes/80s/90s back in the day that all used 4 stud though) - 5-stud on rally competition cars so probably the same.

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 Post subject: Re: 4 stud wheels
PostPosted: Fri Sep 08, 2017 4:45 pm 
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Hello JP,
Yes, I expect some-such, however I have no specific info on it. There must have been an advantage in using the component with the 4 studs. It's not as if they were depending on available wheels, in that I am sure that the wheels were especially made for them,or did homologation come into it? On the face of it, one would expect that the 5 stud wheel would be a more robust solution. Perhaps the available 4 stud configuration afforded advantage in the area of bearing reliability, or brake size or some other context. It may even have been driven by time constraint? In any event, I am sure someone on the forum knows exactly what components could be used today to do such a modification. I have an '89 ST 165 and I am considering this route.


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 Post subject: Re: 4 stud wheels
PostPosted: Fri Sep 08, 2017 8:39 pm 
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Hmm, I wonder if this originated from development on the TA64 rally as teh road going celica of the era was the last 4 stud.

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 Post subject: Re: 4 stud wheels
PostPosted: Mon Sep 11, 2017 1:46 am 
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The TTE Celicas used a completely different drivetrain and chassis/suspension components. You might think a Group A car would have to use homologated road car components but clearly this was not the case! They used cast aluminium (or maybe even magnesium?) hubs and uprights, not to mention Xtrac differentials and gearbox. The subframes were also of tubular steel construction unlike the road car fabricated/pressed steel/welded items.

It all looks bespoke but your best chance would be to speak to some of the ex TTE guys for more info. It's surprising how many of them are still around.

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 Post subject: Re: 4 stud wheels
PostPosted: Tue Sep 12, 2017 1:52 am 
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You can find parts here. They won't be cheap.
http://www.weverssport.com/rallysport/? ... suspension

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 Post subject: Re: 4 stud wheels
PostPosted: Tue Sep 12, 2017 7:31 am 
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Thanks for the replies. We are obviously in high cost territory here. I will instead search about for compatibility of a standard 4 stud hub/wheel carrier to fit GT4 standard components. Someone with access to Toyota part numbers may be able to determine aye or nay?


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 Post subject: Re: 4 stud wheels
PostPosted: Tue Sep 12, 2017 10:28 am 
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Any particular reason you want to convert to a 4 stud wheel pattern? This was only used on the Group A cars. The Group N ST205 used the 5 stud pattern and more of the road car suspension as you can see in the pics thread here: viewtopic.php?f=13&t=2965&hilit=Group+N

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 Post subject: Re: 4 stud wheels
PostPosted: Tue Sep 12, 2017 10:58 am 
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If you have been following the Bad Obsession Motorsport ST185/BMC Mini project (Binky) you might like to look at episode 10 about 25 minutes in:

Binky episode 10

They did not show how the work was done and when replying to a post on the Binky forum they stated that this was because there are safety implications(!) if you *bleep* it up, but it seems it might be possible to modify the PCD.

Fensport used 4x100 drive flanges on the GT4X - I did speak to Adrian about it and as far as I remember he said that the hub parts were from an AE86 Corolla but they did need some modification to fit (and the rest of the suspension is not entirely standard).


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 Post subject: Re: 4 stud wheels
PostPosted: Tue Sep 12, 2017 1:28 pm 
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There is a direct bolt in 4 stud hub from a base model 18x. I think it was an st model.

That will only resolve the fronts. As for the rears you might want to look into the aw11 rear Hubs. I am not sure what style of bearing they use but it may be an option.

I am currently using RAV4 hubs in the front changing mine to 5x114. Once I wear out my extra sets of rear brakes I'll use a lexus set of rear hubs so I will have 5x114 all around.

The best way to check is use the bearing part numbers and find what models share them.

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