As part of my rebuild I am trying to decide on which engine to go for, both engines have their pros and cons and I dont know enough to make an educated guess as to which would be best.

So far and to the best of my knowledge -

The 5SGTE is a good strong block, the best to use is a 1998 onwards 5sfe engine from a Camry or similar. as far as I know the 3sgte head bolts straight on??? but the block needs a bit of modification, firstly a bit of grinding on the back to allow the transfer case to fit without clashing. The turbo needs an oil return fitting to the sump.....maybe a few other minor modifications as well.
One problem with this is getting hold of a 5sfe block, they are few and far between and they need special pistons making up which I believe are available in the US.

Then there is fitting the stroker to the good old 3SGTE, we all know the perceived weakness of the 3sgte block...would fitting a stroker make this worse??? would it be able to handle the extra torque???

which would be the best option or is the benefits not worth the extra expenditure/hastle??? and best off sticking with a normal 3sgte set up?

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ST205

What are the goals for your engine rebuild?

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GT4DC Events Co-ordinator
1996 ST205 UK

Reliable power....but primarily lots of torque.

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ST205

How much power and how much torque?

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GT4DC Events Co-ordinator
1996 ST205 UK

No targets...it'll be what it will be.....hopefully around 400 for both, but if its more or less I wont be upset.

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ST205

i too am in this dilemma, i have a 3sgte in my shed ready to rebuild but am in talks to sell it up and buy a 5s as i want 500bhp and i dont want cracked walls, if you do end up wanting a 5s then i can probably link you to the place i was going to get one from... although they are not in this country so would require shipping costs

The thing that puts me off the 5s is modifying the block, especially things like drilling into the oil gallery for the piston oil squirters.....i would not know where to begin with that.

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ST205

Does anybody know the cylinder wall thickness of a 5S-FE block?

This is the key question really. Long stroke engines generally put more stress on the cylinder walls although it does depend on how the engine is set up hence the question about your power and torque targets. Don't forget any production block being pushed to more than double the output is going to struggle. I would be surprised if the 5S block is any different. Even bespoke racing 2 litre 500bhp turbo engines need a rebuild every 30 hours. Remember this and it will keep your goals in perspective

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Don
GT4DC Chairman
1994 Toyota Celica GT-Four ST205WRC JDM 269bhp @ 0.9bar
1994 Toyota Celica GT-Four Special GT 590bhp @ 1.8bar
1989 Van Diemen RF88/89 Formula Ford 1600
2008 Nissan Patrol GU 3.0L ZD30DDTi 154bhp

In my view you need to have a target in mind to enable you to purchase and work towards your goal in the most efficient manner.

If its 400 then personally I would go for a straight 3S block and try to maximise the torque through careful turbo selection and tuning.

If you don't have a target power output in mind then perhaps it would be wise to set a financial target which would also give you something to work to. Setting neither is a reciepe for lots of wasted money IMO.

I would also recommend doing lots and lots of your own research before deciding.

Good luck.

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GT4DC Events Co-ordinator
1996 ST205 UK

My current thinking which changes frequently

3s block is easy to source and a well known quantity (for better or worse)
5s block over here is rare as rocking horse poo sprinkled with hens teeth

If you break a 3s block replacement is easy if a ballache
If you break a 5s and can't find a replacement you have got a lot of expensive internals worth scrap value

http://www.gt4dc.co.uk/forum/viewtopic. ... c&start=15

scroll to where I started with 5S 2/3rds down, and note what I said on the OC

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GT Four Adovansu

"I want to enjoy the powerful and nimble agility behavior."

Do you want me to pop out to the garage and check?
Give me some guidelines on measuring what you need and I'll see what I can do. Block still needs to be cleaned properly, so will look like crap if I take pictures haha.

Then again, I can also do 3S to 5S block comparisons, but don't want to spread out in the garage at this time. Maybe in 3 months (depending if I get teh car finished..)?

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GT Four Adovansu

"I want to enjoy the powerful and nimble agility behavior."

I think you have just made my mind up for me........will see how it goes but maybe sticking to a 3sgte would be the best thing to do.

How compatible are the SW20 blocks?

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ST205

You really need ultrasonic measuring equipment to do this. If you do manage to get any measurements on the 5S block it would be great if you could share them

There's a good description on www.gtfours.co.uk of the cylinder wall thickness issue as part of the diagrams below

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Don
GT4DC Chairman
1994 Toyota Celica GT-Four ST205WRC JDM 269bhp @ 0.9bar
1994 Toyota Celica GT-Four Special GT 590bhp @ 1.8bar
1989 Van Diemen RF88/89 Formula Ford 1600
2008 Nissan Patrol GU 3.0L ZD30DDTi 154bhp

found it and have read. Remind me when I finish up celica stage 2 - road worthiness, as that is when I will be looking at the 5sgte

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GT Four Adovansu

"I want to enjoy the powerful and nimble agility behavior."