Putting the water temp sensor in the radiator top hose will allow you to monitor the highest coolant temps. The oil temp sensor should ideally be reading the oil feed temp into the sandwich plate not the return from the oil cooler. (obviously!) Best of all is to put the oil temp sensor in the sump as we discussed yesterday as that will be the maximum oil temp.

If it were me I'd confirm there is efficient air flow through the rads before spending money on new rads.

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Don
GT4DC Chairman
1994 Toyota Celica GT-Four ST205WRC JDM 269bhp @ 0.9bar
1994 Toyota Celica GT-Four Special GT 590bhp @ 1.8bar
1989 Van Diemen RF88/89 Formula Ford 1600
2008 Nissan Patrol GU 3.0L ZD30DDTi 154bhp

When I said Saskatchewan what I meant was wheel arch but I appear to have had a disagreement with the spell checker

Don,

The point of the analogy was this is pretty close to an oil cooler setup with very high volumes and flow rates.
Without wishing to continue belabouring the point the lotus setup pictured would be fine providing the cooler has been designed for it. A simple dip tube on the outflow pipe would solve any issues. Maybe Mocal coolers are also designed like that

I did wonder about the Canada reference, weird spellchecker .....

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Don
GT4DC Chairman
1994 Toyota Celica GT-Four ST205WRC JDM 269bhp @ 0.9bar
1994 Toyota Celica GT-Four Special GT 590bhp @ 1.8bar
1989 Van Diemen RF88/89 Formula Ford 1600
2008 Nissan Patrol GU 3.0L ZD30DDTi 154bhp

I've not studied airflow into wings, but I'm under the impression that the space between arch & liner is open at the front via the holes under the indicators but closed off everywhere else. If so, the wing area will be pressurised by ram air.

Applying the laws of physics to an upside-down oil cooler, there will be a pressure difference across the length of a 'row' which will be proportional to flow rate, oil viscosity and it's 'resistance'.
When the cooler is initially full of air, the incoming oil will push up until it reaches the first row and then start flowing along it. The area above the oil at this end will be equal to the pressure at the oulet (as equalised by the rows above). If the pressure difference is great enough to lift the oil up to the second row, it will start flowing through that too. This will the reduce the pressure difference as there is half the restriction overall. If there is still enough pressure difference, the oil level will continue upwards until an equilibrium is reached. Think of it as a multi level weir. If the restriction is great enough, all rows will be filled and therefore self bleed. If the restriction is not great enough, then the system needs to be 'bled' so the syphon effect comes into play.
So, it's all down to design of the oil cooler and how much pressure it drops at the normal flow rate and normal oil temperature. Bear in mind this is probably very different when cold.
Do the spec sheets provide figures or graphs for pressure drop vs flow rate on the particular cooler, and is the flow rate for 3sgte known ?

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If at first you don't suck seed, try drier grain.

My concern is that you have done all this wonderful work to achieve such high horse power but with more horse power comes more heat and more heat means more problems, so I was surprised to see that you are still using the earlier GT4 style bonnet and with that you have blocked the vent up too which is only going to make things worse. The heat in your engine bay must be astronomical when on full chat and personally I think this is where most of your problems lie.
As I stated earlier, getting the air out is as just important as getting the air into and through your radiators and coolers.
Maybe see if you can borrow a CS bonnet to try out and see if that makes any differents. Dorris

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Black CS 2771

I fitted a fibreglass CS bonnet on my 185 and to be honest it made very little difference to underbonet temperatures. I think the front bumper must provide a much larger gain.


Blocking off the bonet scoop probably will increase underbonet temps but it will certainly reduce pressure behind the rad and increase airflow through the rads as a result.

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If at first you don't suck seed, try drier grain.

Blocking off the bonet scoop probably will increase underbonet temps but it will certainly reduce pressure behind the rad and increase airflow through the rads as a result.[/quote]

this is y i blocked of the scoop

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Perhaps you should fit a bigger cooler if other things appear to be ok.

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GT4DC Events Co-ordinator
1996 ST205 UK

not rely got room for a bigger cooler but might fit a second 1 and see if that helps, it only does it when I’m on track for a long time and using full boost, all the time if you look at my video of me at rally day you can see just how quick I was going doing a 1.23sec lap which is pretty quick I have all so see for some reading up that the oil should be at 110-120c for optimum performance but I stink that is a bit to hi

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this is y i blocked of the scoop[/quote]

This was the point I was trying to make if you are suffering from positive pressure behind the radiator then that obviously indicates that your are not exhausting the heat and air from the engine bay and correct me if i’m wrong but aren’t you running an under tray too? If so the air can’t escape via that route either even though may not be the most efficient way to duct hot air.
Whatever air goes into and through the front of the car has to equally exhaust, you can have the world’s biggest and most efficient radiators and coolers but if you block the rear it becomes as useful as a chocolate teapot.
I’m sure that if heat wasn’t an issue race teams and designers would spend millions on air flow v cooling.
I still believe that your coolers and radiators are more then adequate enough to do the job but just not maybe being utilised as efficiently as they could. Dorris

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Black CS 2771

I see what you’re saying but what if I still had the top mount intercooler the scoop would be blocked by that and the air would not come out of as it would be going in throw the top mount. yes I have an under tray but it doesn’t go all the way under the engine it finishes just be for the sump so there is plenty of room for the air to come out the bottom. im going to look at jaking the bonnet at the back to see if that helps

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BRD Page

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make a simple manometer.

set it to measure the difference from in front and behind the radiators in question ( water and oil )

you want a difference for air to flow effectively through and cool.
larger the difference ( with the lower behind !!! ) is better.

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--

Darryl

just rememberd i have 2 big loverd vents eather side of the bonnet so guss this should be pulling the hot air out.

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Hi,

air is a hard to evaluate medium but in that case it's simple,

the air should enter the bay just over the radiator package, every other entry raises the bay pressure and lowers the flow over the radiator package
for a further increase in flow you also should gave the air points to exit the bay to lower the pressure (bonnet & undertray)
here you can also trick the same way as on the CS & ST205 bonnet with air flow break-away edges (the empirical formula is 1cm edge covers 10cm length)

everytime i talk about this i also gave a note to a pipe instead of a hose from the radiator to the water pump, thats on of the best mods i ever did and cheap to do
the hose can (or will) pull together under high revs (=high water flow) and the thermostat is fully opened which can reduce the water flow down to 30% in extreme situations (dynamic pressure & air that pulls together on the pressure side of the water pump aka engine are the reasons)

thanks from your turbo oem oil cooler and the whole engine looks like this are situations you drive frequently

hope it helps

greetz

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KEEP COOL UNDER PRESSURE

street legal?.....perhaps in tschibuti

Hey guys,

Just thought i'd share my cooling experience from my trip to Nur last weekend.

I got a ebay 10 row oil cooler with filter relocation kit (no thermostat) and one of these large ebay st205 Ally Rads.

I saw peak oil temps of roughly 85 degrees C.

Off track my normal running temps are around 75 degrees C.

Not sure what my water temps were as i dont have an aftermarket gauge but the stock gauge never went above the normal mark. I had a quick glance on my way into Foxhole on my 4th lap and noticed it actually dip a little - probably cooled loads from the high speed section past 'MR2 Corner'.

Was quite a warm weekend, i think it was around the high 20's.

I have the oil cooler and my larger UK gearbox cooler mounted in the front arches in front of the front wheels. So air comes through the small vents under the indicators, through the coolers and then onto the front brakes.