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 Post subject: non starter
PostPosted: Sun Sep 01, 2013 4:22 pm 
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Clubman

Joined: Tue May 22, 2012 2:47 pm
Posts: 65
Location: Andover, Hants
Car Model: ST185
Small issue with the 4. Basically once the starter motor engages (the arm pops out) the electrical systems seem to short out. Everything else on the car is working but can't get my head.round this one. Anyone had similar issues?


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 Post subject: Re: non starter
PostPosted: Sun Sep 01, 2013 5:00 pm 
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Joined: Thu Jul 14, 2005 12:44 pm
Posts: 4067
Location: drinking devil fuel
Car Model: ST205
Likely just a flat/dead battery


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 Post subject: Re: non starter
PostPosted: Sun Sep 01, 2013 6:35 pm 
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Clubman

Joined: Tue May 22, 2012 2:47 pm
Posts: 65
Location: Andover, Hants
Car Model: ST185
Changed the battery and still nothing. I had the immobilizer removed as that was the original issue (a solenoid was bust) and changed the battery after the mechanics had been round to sort it


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 Post subject: Re: non starter
PostPosted: Sun Sep 01, 2013 8:03 pm 
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Joined: Sat Oct 08, 2011 11:40 pm
Posts: 34
Location: Tidworth
Car Model: ST185
When you say the electrical system shorts out, do you mean once you turn the key to start it everything stops as in no power at all, if it is sounds like a dodgy earth to me.

Sent from my GT-N7100 using Tapatalk 2

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White 1990 GT Four ST185 (Import)
Now with 205 engine, ecu, engine & internal loom inc Speedo binacle and heater control.


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 Post subject: Re: non starter
PostPosted: Sun Sep 01, 2013 8:26 pm 
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Joined: Sat Sep 02, 2006 3:13 pm
Posts: 3679
Location: Bournemouth
Car Model: None
As above, does evrything cut out or is it just the starter, and what do you do to get the power back on ?

Quite a common symptom in battery relocations if the earth to the battery isn't connected to a good earth, suspention turrets are NOT good earths.

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 Post subject: Re: non starter
PostPosted: Mon Sep 02, 2013 4:33 pm 
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Clubman

Joined: Tue May 22, 2012 2:47 pm
Posts: 65
Location: Andover, Hants
Car Model: ST185
yea basically everything cuts out and seems like all the circuits need to re-charge themselves. Funny you say about the earth as the guy who sold it to me made his own "relocation kit" with zero gauge wire... At the moment I'm using the original battery clamps but the earth wire isn't there anymore and a using a jump cable to ground it... where would be a better location to ground it and what sort of wire would you recommend for the level of charge going through it.


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 Post subject: Re: non starter
PostPosted: Mon Sep 02, 2013 5:26 pm 
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Clubman

Joined: Tue May 22, 2012 2:47 pm
Posts: 65
Location: Andover, Hants
Car Model: ST185
right, I have eliminated this problem. the car remains 'fully charged' but still not action from the starter. I hear a click like its trying to engage but not movement in the crank arm. starter fried?


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 Post subject: Re: non starter
PostPosted: Mon Sep 02, 2013 5:58 pm 
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Joined: Sat Sep 02, 2006 3:13 pm
Posts: 3679
Location: Bournemouth
Car Model: None
Check there is a good heavy Earth wire from the body to the engine.#

Normally there is a big earth wire from battery to engine direct and a smaller one from battery to body. With a relocation you need a big wire from battery to body and then a big wire from body to engine. (typically near 10mm dia). All the body Earths need to be good contact direct to the body metal with paint removed / grease applied to stop rust.

If the above fails, connect a voltmeter direct on the starter between the big + terminal on the starter and one of the starter fixings so you get a good contact, then get someone to click the starter - check if the voltage drops significantly (normally about 8 or 9 ish while cranking).
I have also known starters to just click when fed via the starter switch but to actually work if you connect direct from the small start terminal to the incoming +12 terminal, I think they need the extra kick to pull in. This is usually intermittant.

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 Post subject: Re: non starter
PostPosted: Mon Sep 02, 2013 7:22 pm 
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Clubman

Joined: Tue May 22, 2012 2:47 pm
Posts: 65
Location: Andover, Hants
Car Model: ST185
volt meter reads 12.6 with key in ignition (volt meter attached to starter) and .336 when key is turned... doesnt sound right


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 Post subject: Re: non starter
PostPosted: Mon Sep 02, 2013 8:14 pm 
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Location: Bournemouth
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bennyboi88 wrote:
volt meter reads 12.6 with key in ignition (volt meter attached to starter) and .336 when key is turned... doesnt sound right


So you have a high resistance either between battery- and starter - (battery Earth strap which will be OK if lights stay on now or engine to body earth strap) OR between battery + and starter + terminal.

Next step, repeat the test but measure between body and engine. If you get a significant voltage then the Engine Earth strap is duff.

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 Post subject: Re: non starter
PostPosted: Mon Sep 02, 2013 8:18 pm 
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Clubman

Joined: Tue May 22, 2012 2:47 pm
Posts: 65
Location: Andover, Hants
Car Model: ST185
Nibbles wrote:
bennyboi88 wrote:
volt meter reads 12.6 with key in ignition (volt meter attached to starter) and .336 when key is turned... doesnt sound right


So you have a high resistance either between battery- and starter - (battery Earth strap which will be OK if lights stay on now or engine to body earth strap) OR between battery + and starter + terminal.

Next step, repeat the test but measure between body and engine. If you get a significant voltage then the Engine Earth strap is duff.



so attach one lead from the volt meter to the engine and the other to the car shell?


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 Post subject: Re: non starter
PostPosted: Mon Sep 02, 2013 8:45 pm 
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Joined: Sat Oct 08, 2011 11:40 pm
Posts: 34
Location: Tidworth
Car Model: ST185
Could also be the starter motor sticking, when it spins it contacts two brass points inside which one can twist a little its the one where live attaches to the bolt on the outer casewhen tightened it may cause it to happen

Sent from my GT-N7100 using Tapatalk 2

_________________
White 1990 GT Four ST185 (Import)
Now with 205 engine, ecu, engine & internal loom inc Speedo binacle and heater control.


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 Post subject: Re: non starter
PostPosted: Mon Sep 02, 2013 8:51 pm 
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Clubman

Joined: Tue May 22, 2012 2:47 pm
Posts: 65
Location: Andover, Hants
Car Model: ST185
www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Toyota-Celica-ST205- ... 2c723f096a
the metal plate with the groves in it, whats the purpose of that? mine is just sitting there... box of worms....


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 Post subject: Re: non starter
PostPosted: Mon Sep 02, 2013 8:53 pm 
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Clubman

Joined: Tue May 22, 2012 2:47 pm
Posts: 65
Location: Andover, Hants
Car Model: ST185
bennyboi88 wrote:
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Toyota-Celica-ST205-GT-4-Four-3S-GTE-Starter-Motor-RED-WORKING-/190895294826?pt=UK_CarsParts_Vehicles_CarParts_SM&fits=Model%3ACelica&hash=item2c723f096a
the metal plate with the groves in it, whats the purpose of that? mine is just sitting there... box of worms....


as in the one in the pic on the link


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 Post subject: Re: non starter
PostPosted: Mon Sep 02, 2013 8:55 pm 
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Clubman

Joined: Tue May 22, 2012 2:47 pm
Posts: 65
Location: Andover, Hants
Car Model: ST185
gt4col wrote:
Could also be the starter motor sticking, when it spins it contacts two brass points inside which one can twist a little its the one where live attaches to the bolt on the outer casewhen tightened it may cause it to happen

Sent from my GT-N7100 using Tapatalk 2



have replaced the starter just to be sure...


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