www.gt4dc.co.uk
Maintain, Modify and DRIVE your GT-Four


It is currently Sat Apr 27, 2024 10:42 am




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 16 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2  Next
Author Message
PostPosted: Mon Mar 11, 2013 5:20 pm 
Offline
Club Staff
User avatar

Joined: Wed Jul 13, 2005 12:14 am
Posts: 3265
Location: Camberley, Surrey
Car Model: ST205
Found these articles referenced on Pistonheads. I thought them quite interesting:

http://www.bmwracedays.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2011/10/Issue-3-Heel-Toe-Part-1.pdf
http://www.bmwracedays.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2011/10/Issue-4-Heel-Toe-Part-2.pdf

I am not the best peddler by a long way and will openly admit I wouldn't have a clue how to heel and toe, the articles have gone a little way to explain the theory and practice so now I can go out and practice with at least the knowledge of why its beneficial and the point behind it.

_________________
GT4DC Events Co-ordinator
1996 ST205 UK


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Mar 11, 2013 5:38 pm 
Offline
Group N
User avatar

Joined: Tue Apr 10, 2012 9:27 am
Posts: 409
Location: Chirnside, Scottish Borders
Car Model: ST205
Ive been using this technique for ages and Im guilty of doing all the steps as independent actions rather than one smooth movement as he talks about in the articles. Its interesting to read that almost a second a lap can be saved in some instances, thats a lot of time!! :D

If I lost 5 stone Id save a second too but thats not going to happen!!

_________________
FN2 Civic Type R w/Mugen Parts
Toyota Celica GT4 ST205
Toyota Celica GT4 ST185


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Mar 11, 2013 6:10 pm 
Offline
Club Staff
User avatar

Joined: Thu Jul 14, 2005 12:44 pm
Posts: 4067
Location: drinking devil fuel
Car Model: ST205
Hai,
Twinkle Toes here :shock:


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Mar 11, 2013 6:18 pm 
Offline
Group N
User avatar

Joined: Tue Apr 10, 2012 9:27 am
Posts: 409
Location: Chirnside, Scottish Borders
Car Model: ST205
thinking you can heel toe and actually doing it are two different things


I fall into the former camp :( lol

_________________
FN2 Civic Type R w/Mugen Parts
Toyota Celica GT4 ST205
Toyota Celica GT4 ST185


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Mar 11, 2013 6:19 pm 
Offline
Club Staff
User avatar

Joined: Wed Jul 13, 2005 12:14 am
Posts: 3265
Location: Camberley, Surrey
Car Model: ST205
Heh - I had a different camp entirely which was - Heel and Toe seems really hard and I don't understand the point so I'm not going to bother :D

_________________
GT4DC Events Co-ordinator
1996 ST205 UK


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Mar 11, 2013 6:34 pm 
Offline
Group N
User avatar

Joined: Tue Apr 10, 2012 9:27 am
Posts: 409
Location: Chirnside, Scottish Borders
Car Model: ST205
Ive just got confused mike, I looked at your avatar picture and thought it was me, has been messing with me since I uploaded my picture, very similar to yours.

I can remember 1st doing heel toe and just ending up with my feet underneath all the pedals more often than not

_________________
FN2 Civic Type R w/Mugen Parts
Toyota Celica GT4 ST205
Toyota Celica GT4 ST185


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Mar 11, 2013 6:45 pm 
Offline
Club Staff
User avatar

Joined: Wed Jul 13, 2005 12:14 am
Posts: 3265
Location: Camberley, Surrey
Car Model: ST205
I might change mine - have had the same one for aaaggggeees.

Yes - agree, whenever I have tried to heel toe in the past it generally ends up with the car bucking around all over the place and me looking like a fool.

_________________
GT4DC Events Co-ordinator
1996 ST205 UK


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Mar 11, 2013 7:39 pm 
Offline
Group B
User avatar

Joined: Sat Sep 02, 2006 3:13 pm
Posts: 3679
Location: Bournemouth
Car Model: None
I ganerally use the right hand side of my foot on the throttle rather that twisting right round as some of my past cars that was impractical. I learnt while I was uni, and have done it ever since as a matter of course without thinking about it. I only notice when I'm driving someone elses car and realise I'm struggling when I change down.
It does make a noticable difference to how hard you can brake without locking wheels, and hence allows later braking. It's not just a seconds a lap advantage, but allows outbraking manoevers.

_________________
If at first you don't suck seed, try drier grain.

Image


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Mar 11, 2013 8:04 pm 
Offline
Club Staff
User avatar

Joined: Wed Jul 13, 2005 12:06 am
Posts: 4743
Location: Perth, Western Australia
Car Model: ST205
Heel and toe is easy compared to left foot braking or the long lost art of double-declutching since largle rendered obsolete by modern synchromesh. There was some interesting live video of Allan McNish footwork in the Audi at Le Mans a few years ago. I think he said he reverted to heel and toe for the endurance racing as this was easier on the mechanicals over a long race. I tried left foot braking several times and almost crashed! I think unless you have a strong karting background it doesn't feel natural.

_________________
Don
GT4DC Chairman
1994 Toyota Celica GT-Four ST205WRC JDM 269bhp @ 0.9bar
1994 Toyota Celica GT-Four Special GT 590bhp @ 1.8bar
1989 Van Diemen RF88/89 Formula Ford 1600
2008 Nissan Patrol GU 3.0L ZD30DDTi 154bhp


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Mar 11, 2013 8:04 pm 
Offline
Club Staff
User avatar

Joined: Thu Jul 14, 2005 12:44 pm
Posts: 4067
Location: drinking devil fuel
Car Model: ST205
I'm on the third installment, double declutching as my second gear is made of crunchium
I'm a leg twister, should try to cure that I suppose


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Mar 11, 2013 8:06 pm 
Offline
Club Staff
User avatar

Joined: Thu Jul 14, 2005 12:44 pm
Posts: 4067
Location: drinking devil fuel
Car Model: ST205
I left foot brake in autos
There's a bulge in JP's Mondeo windscreen to prove it :lol:


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Mar 11, 2013 8:09 pm 
Offline
Club Staff
User avatar

Joined: Wed Jul 13, 2005 12:06 am
Posts: 4743
Location: Perth, Western Australia
Car Model: ST205
That's cheating!

_________________
Don
GT4DC Chairman
1994 Toyota Celica GT-Four ST205WRC JDM 269bhp @ 0.9bar
1994 Toyota Celica GT-Four Special GT 590bhp @ 1.8bar
1989 Van Diemen RF88/89 Formula Ford 1600
2008 Nissan Patrol GU 3.0L ZD30DDTi 154bhp


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Mar 11, 2013 8:30 pm 
Offline
Group B
User avatar

Joined: Sat Sep 02, 2006 3:13 pm
Posts: 3679
Location: Bournemouth
Car Model: None
I learnt double declutching first, then extended it to include heal & toe to allow double declutching while braking.

Left foot braking - from my karting history I find it natural enough, but I've never really sussed using it for car control. My attempts were scuppered about 10 years ago when my cars started running 'fly by wire' pedals which cut power when braking.

_________________
If at first you don't suck seed, try drier grain.

Image


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Mar 11, 2013 9:54 pm 
Offline
Group N
User avatar

Joined: Tue Apr 10, 2012 9:27 am
Posts: 409
Location: Chirnside, Scottish Borders
Car Model: ST205
left foot braking is wierd, enough said! :D

thats what the right foot is for

_________________
FN2 Civic Type R w/Mugen Parts
Toyota Celica GT4 ST205
Toyota Celica GT4 ST185


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Tue Mar 19, 2013 11:24 pm 
Offline
Club Staff
User avatar

Joined: Wed Jul 13, 2005 6:54 pm
Posts: 3484
Location: On Top
Car Model: None
Is it a good excuse to post the Senna NSX video?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jjbrFBE4x8A

I can vouch that steve can left foot brake in an auto:-) His heel & toe work however is very impressive.

I am bad at heel/toe or left foot braking - trying both together is impossible for my brain and hence I have mastered shoeing the horn and fingering the cigarette lighter.

_________________
JP
GT4DC Treasurer

Grey St185 RC
Silver BMW E46 M3
Multicolour yawn Honda VFR400
Silver Honda Civic Type-R


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 16 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2  Next


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 139 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
cron
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group